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Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:56 pm
by alangore
Hello everyone, I just thought that I would let you know that I was present at Nottingham Crown court this afternoon to watch Peter Kenneth Smith being sentenced by Mrs Justice Dobbs. He had been found guilty for the second time of the murder of Hilda Owen in 2007. AG

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 3:44 am
by Taggart
Alan,

Thanks for the update. I have been following this case closely over the last few days/weeks. As you seem to be involved in the case perhaps you could share your observations with the readers on the fingerprint evidence which was presented.
For those unaware, the Metropolitan Police appear from the reports to have disputed the identification. Not just one experts, but if accurate a Panel of Met Experts.
A MURDER trial jury has heard how fingerprint experts disagreed about the origin of a bloodstained print found at the home of Skegby pensioner Hilda Owen.
A panel of Metropolitan Police experts, used by the defence team in the trial of Peter Kenneth Smith, found that the fingerprint discovered on a door handle was not Smith’s.
But Nottingham Crown Court heard last week that independent expert Alan Gore, called by the prosecution, identified the print as belonging to the accused.
Smith (48) denies battering his 71-year-old next door neighbour to death at her home in West Hill over five years ago.
It is alleged he sought to benefit from the widow’s will in order to solve his financial problems.
Expert Lisa Hall, questioned by Peter Joyce, QC, prosecuting, said the door handle mark was complex.
At first the panel had said they could not exclude Smith. But they were leaving the matter open to further discussion.
The panel gave consideration to Mr Gore’s ‘double touch’ theory but did not agree with it.
Later they considered the possibility that the print was left by Callum Adams, who lived with Smith for some time before leaving his house on 21st February 2007, a week before Mrs Owen was killed.
Adams is currently serving a prison sentence for killing a partner in 2009.
The witness told the jury: “We can’t say it is Callum Adams’s print but we can’t exclude him.”
I did not see any evidence at this Trial of Peter Swann giving evidence. Given he was key to the conviction being quashed, has the legal profession finally woken up to the fact he is guilty of making two of the biggest errors in the Science, and has no credibility?

I also recalled at the time of the quashing of the original conviction the Official Report withheld certain informtion until after the retrial. I found this information last night and was shocked at how close this was to the SCRO/McKie saga with its criticism!

http://for-sci-law-now.blogspot.co.uk/2 ... -with.html
(7) General issues relating to fingerprint evidence

61. In the light of the issue in relation to Ms Tweedy’s qualifications and the way in which the evidence was adduced at trial, we consider it important that we should identify some of the features which have become apparent to us. None have been material to the decision we have in fact reached in this case as to the safety of the conviction, but as they are important to the way in which fingerprint evidence is adduced where the print is not clear; we set them out:
i) Most forensic science services have for some time been provided by organisations wholly independent of police forces. There are also a number of private providers of forensic science services. In contradistinction, fingerprint experts are organised in Fingerprint Bureaux which fall within the organisational structure of each police force. This may be a distinction that is justified; it may be possible for independence to be assured by strict standards of control on quality and by accountability.
ii) There is no opportunity for a person outside a police Fingerprint Bureau to become fully qualified as a fingerprint expert by training in England and Wales or for having that person’s competence recognised by the police forces.
iii) Police forces do not recognise the qualifications or competence of those who have obtained these overseas. It is for a judge to decide whether a person is a competent expert, not the police. Because of the course the trial took, the judge did not have to rule on whether Ms Tweedy, who obtained qualifications overseas, was a competent expert.
iv) It is essential for the proper administration of justice that there are independent persons expert in fingerprint examination; almost all who do this are retired from police Fingerprint Bureaux. The position is in marked contrast to other forensic science disciplines. There may be good reason for this distinction; for example the fingerprint bureau of other forces may be able to provide expert evidence for the defence.
v) No competent forensic scientist in other areas of forensic science these days would conduct an examination without keeping detailed notes of his examination and the reasons for his conclusions. That universal practice of other forensic scientists was not followed by the Nottinghamshire Fingerprint Bureau. There may be reasons for this, but they were not explained to us.
vi) As neither the original examiner nor those who confirmed his examination made any notes of their reasons and did not identify the points of comparison contemporaneously on a chart, it was not possible to see whether their reasoning was the same. We were told that this was not done because those who made the subsequent identification should make that identification without knowing the views of those who had previously examined the print. Although we accept that identification by two other persons who do not know the conclusions of the original examiner or the other examiner form an important safeguard, we do not understand that reasoning. There would be nothing to prevent the earlier examiners sealing their conclusions until the completion of all the examinations. We do not know whether there is any other justification for examiners not making detailed contemporaneous notes that can be the subject of transparent examination in court where the identification of the mark is in issue.

vii) The quality of the reports provided by the Nottinghamshire Fingerprint Bureau for the trial reflected standards that existed in other areas of forensic science some years ago and not the vastly improved standards expected in contemporary forensic science.
viii) The presentation of the evidence to the jury made no attempt to use modern methods of presentation. The presentation to this court was similar; a large amount of time was wasted because of this. It was incomprehensible to us why digital images were not provided to the jury; the refusal of NAFIS (to which we have referred in paragraph 43) to permit a digital image to be supplied to the court was a further example of the lack of a contemporary approach to the presentation of evidence. The presentation to the jury must be done in such a way that enables the jury to determine the disputed issues.
This is one of the very few cases where fingerprint evidence has been challenged at a trial since 1999 and, as far as we are aware, the first since then to come before this court on an appeal where this court has had to hear fresh evidence. It is not unsurprising that the points we have raised identify practices which differ so markedly in England and Wales from modern forensic science practice in other areas of forensic science.

62. There is plainly a need for the points that have arisen in this case to be the subject of wider examination. We have been told that an enquiry by the Rt Hon Sir Anthony Campbell into the case of HM Advocate v McKie known as the Scottish Fingerprint Enquiry has heard extensive evidence in relation to fingerprint evidence in Scotland. It is not for us to comment more than we have done at paragraph 61 in relation to the practices that have come to our attention in this appeal. In our view, however, there is a real need for the ACPO, the Forensic Science Regulator and the recently established Fingerprint Quality Standards Specialist Group to examine as expeditiously as possible the issues we have identified, to assess the position and to ensure that there are common quality standards enforced through a robust and accountable system.
A few observations and questions. (This Appeal was dated 24 may 2011)

What have ACPO, the Forensic Science Regulator and the Fingerprint Quality Standards Specialist Group done to examine as expeditiously as possible the issues identified, to assess the position and to ensure that there are common quality standards enforced through a robust and accountable system?

What have Nottinghamshire done to address the damning criticism of their Record keeping, their Reports and their court presentations?

The Appeal Reports mentions Swann and that “54. Mr Swann identified 10 points on the left side of the print which he said could not be seen on the appellant’s print.” If he found 10 characteristics in the latent print how many did the Met find that were consistent with Adam’s print?

At the time Swann gave evidence at this Appeal he had been discredited over two misidentifications, on what basis did the Appeal Judge deem him to be a competent exepert?

I understand the Met were called in to carry out an independent review of the case, and at that point they found what they reported as a misidentification. Have Nottinghamshire accepted the findings of the Metropolitan Police, or are they still maintaining it is an identification?

Alan, I might be wrong to assume, but it would appear you may be the expert who gave evidence in this trial. Do you stand by your identification, and what are your observations about the findings of the Metropolitan Police who disagreed with you? Are they wrong in their findings?

I understand there was other evidence in this case against the accused, and no one will ever know if the Jury accepted or rejected the fingerprint evidence, but this case is absolutely damming, once again, for the science of Fingerprints. I heard mention recently this was England’s Shirley McKie.

While I also believe the Metropolitan Police do a wonderful job, I personally would accept their evidence with a bit more credibility if I knew the full facts about their misidentification in the Andrew Chiory case, which to my knowledge has been swept under the carpet. I am open to being proved wrong if someone can provide the full facts on that case.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:42 am
by alangore
Dear Taggart,
Thanks for your post and now that the matter is no longer "sub judice" I am eager to answer any questions so that everyone interested can be apprised of the facts surrounding the case and the evidence that was given at Nottingham Crown Court over the last few weeks.
I was the first expert in the witness box and was present throughout the fingerprint evidence given by my colleagues (Pat Wardle and Bob MacShane) and the Metropolitan Police panel (six in total; panel chair, photographer, blood analyst, and three experts). Just for the record, the article quoted by you refers to me as an "independent expert". I was employed by Nottinghamshire Police until December 2011, and now by the regional policing body responsible for forensic services in Derbyshire, Nottinghamshire and Lincolnshire (EMSOU-FS).
Briefly, I examined the findings of the three groups of experts who disagreed with me, as they arose, and gave full consideration to their conclusions. Nothing that was written or said by any of them caused me to alter my position at any time that the mark in question was made by Peter Kenneth Smith.
I will deal with all of your queries,however, as today is my wife's birthday I will be out for most of the day. Tomorrow I will make a start on answering the questions and addressing the points raised by you.
Best Wishes, Alan Gore.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:48 am
by Taggart
Thanks Alan. Hope you have great day, and look forward to your responses.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:48 pm
by Tazman
alangore wrote:. . . now that the matter is no longer "sub judice" I am eager to answer any questions so that everyone interested can be apprised of the facts surrounding the case and the evidence that was given at Nottingham Crown Court . . . .
Not knowing the rules of evidence in England, I don't have a clue whether you can post the images on the internet. But if you can, then maybe you could link them to this discussion or maybe the webmaster could post them on a separate page in his "Site Features" or "Online Info" columns. I, for one, would love to see them for myself.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:20 pm
by Neville
Hi Alan
I look forward to your comments, hope you had a great birthday, had mine last week sunning and swimming at Noosa Queensland (27degrees C+). But back to work this week and 7 degrees cooler!
Q. Would you produce your evidence differently the first time round in hindsight?
Q. Were the characteristics of blood on fingerprint ridges ever talked about in court?
Q. Do you believe that there will be changes to Fingerprints UK as a result?
Cheers
Neville

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2012 6:07 am
by Michael W. Wieners
Hello Neville.

The following quote from your post is completely innaccurate: "Clearly displayed when to the world media in Spain the FBI told told us all that the Spanish Police did not know what they were talking about, more or less saying they were ignorant; we are the FBI we know what we are talking about. At the time I wondered how the NZ Police would have dealt with such arrogance. I smelt a rat then and there I wondered if the FBI had got it completely wrong as the FBI spokesman admitted he had not identified the print. What on earth were they thinking, why did they send no expert with them to discuss it with the Spanish experts and view the original material. It could have saved a whole lot of problems. Having read another blog on this site I am a little concered that there may still be a bit of arrogance hiding in their mind set."

I was the FBI representative that spoke directly to the Spanish National Police via email, phone and face to face in Madrid on two occasions. Despite what was reported in the press and perpetuated by ill-informed observers and gossips, the FBI and the SNP latent examiners enjoyed a professional, respectful relationship throughout. Neither side was arrogant and both sides simply wanted to get to the truth of the matter, which we did.

While individuals within any organization can be arrogant, an entire organization is not necessarily to be condemned. Rest easy in knowing that the FBI Latent Print Units are on a constant vigil to guard against bias and arrogance.

Feel free to respond with any questions on points I can possibly clear up for you.

V/r,

Michael W. Wieners

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:41 am
by alangore
Dear Neville,
Sounds like you had a great birthday in the warm sun. We had a cold and rainy night in Nottingham, but the French meal followed by a night at the opera (Janacek, not the Marx brothers' film!) were both excellent.
I wonder if it might be useful if I set out the sequence of events at the trials and appeal hearing and the issues talked about in court.
1. 2008 trial. The independent examiner was Catherine Tweedy who visited Nottinghamshire bureau in connection with her review of the evidence. She did not give evidence at the trial but Simon Bunter, her colleague, who verified her findings, did. In summary, they both came to the conclusion that the mark contained insufficient detail on which to base an identification, and questioned whether my conclusion could be relied upon. Verdict: guilty - unanimous
2. 2010 appeal. Peter Swann and Allan Ford were called upon by the defence to examine the mark. Peter Swann visited Nottinghamshire bureau in connection with his review. Both Mr Swann and Mr Ford gave evidence at the hearing and neither Tweedy nor Bunter were involved. Swann and Ford said that the print was not made by Peter Smith. The main issues spoken about in the trial were:a) The area of the print (in blood on a door handle) was described by me (and my two colleagues) as a double touch. Two distinct areas, one of which contained enough unique detail to individualise and, the other which did not. Swann and Ford said that it was all one mark and therefore there was detail in disagreement. b) The mark was caused by blood on the ridges being deposited in the area used for identification purposes. Swann and Ford said that it was blood in the furrows. Conviction quashed re-retrial ordered with on screen presentation specified.
There was an adjournment of about six weeks.
At the second date in this appeal hearing, I illustrated my answers using on screen presentation (as directed by Lord Justice Thomas at the first appeal hearing date). I used Adobe Photoshop CS to stage the images and illustrate my findings and remained in the witness box (at Lord Justice Thomas's direction) to stage images during Peter Swann's second appearance in the witness box.
3. 2012 trial. None of the previous independent experts were present or gave evidence. The Metropolitan police team gave evidence and broadly came to the same final conclusions as Swann and Ford that the print was not made by Peter Smith, that it was not a double touch (detail therefore in disagreement) and that the mark was made by blood in furrows and not on ridges. On this occasion the courtroom was fitted out with monitors. I presented on screen evidence from a prepared presentation (including tutorial section) as well as using images staged, using Adobe Photoshop CS, to illustrate certain answers. My colleagues also used the same presentation and the Met all had individual powerpoint presentations. Verdict: guilty -unanimous.

I have to go out now but will try and post more later.

Best wishes, Alan.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2012 3:34 pm
by g.
Hi Mike,

I don't wish to highjack this thread, so I am hopeful perhaps if people do have questions we can start a new thread with your response to my questions....

I have two questions: 1) can you contact me off line at glenn@eliteforensicservices.com, please? I have a semi-related question to this topic and your post is exceptionally well-timed to my need. 2) One thing about Mayfield case that I am not aware of, but was asked on the stand, was whether or not Daoud's DNA was subsequently identified to a backpack associated with evidence in this case. I was testifiying in the MN v Hull matter and the defense (with SImon Cole) asked me something like "Were it not for the DNA in cases like Cowans and Mayfield we would not know about the erroneous identifications, isnt' that true?". I thought he was mistaken at first, so agreed it was so in Cowans, but not Mayfield, but then he corrected me adding that "Wasn't Daoud's DNA found on a backpack (like on the straps of the pack or something, like "wearer DNA") in the Mayfield case thus in some way "confirming" the Daoud fingerprint match...?

I was really caught off guard by that. I had never heard that before. Do you know if it's true? I said I didn't know. There were a couple of people from the FBI LPU also in courthouse observing the hearing too, I asked them later and they were just as surprised as I was to hear that. Any idea?

Thanks in advance...

PS-whatever people may say about the error: how/why it happened, etc... I don't think many people outside the FBI realize the immense changes and improvements that have occurred there. While this incident is unfortuante I am sure for those involved and Mayfield/his family, it was an error that was caught, owned, and most importantly, your organization has taken amazing leaps forward to improve practices, change training regimes, increase transparency, etc. My experiences with the FBI post-Mayfield have been so different than pre-Mayfield. Not to mention all that research that Noblis is doing with the FBI is incredible (Black Box, White Box, Repeatability, Quality tests, etc.). That's all a consequence of Mayfield in a way. A LOT of good has come out of something that is seen as such a negative. I don't think the community has learned to appreciate this "fortunate" error yet. Plus think of how many authors would have to find a DIFFERENT introduction line to their papers? "Recent criticisms and High Profile errors like the Brandon Mayfield case show that fingerprints, once the gold standard of forensic evidence...yada yada yada". =)

g.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 6:53 am
by alangore
Hello,
A few answers to outstanding questions:-
1. I have just checked the Appeal judgements site; http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Crim/2011/1296.html and it appears that paragraphs 63 to 89 are still to be published.
2. Mr Swann found ten characteristics in the left hand side of the print. Mr Ford found eight but only a few were the same ones as Swann's. The Met panel found varying numbers but agreed on three in common. This side of the print is characterised by disruption to ridge flow and other factors affecting the deposition of the mark. It was not part of the area presented in court by me as containing the core characteristics used in the identification.
3. The Met found varying numbers of characteristics in common with Adams but agreed on four in one area and three in another. Some found more than this number in each area. I disagreed with this.
4.I stand by my findings and therefore I disagree with the conclusion/findings of the Met panel.
5. Yes, there was other circumstantial evidence in this case and in fact Mr Smith was charged with the offence, prior to the identification being made.
6. At the time, South Yorkshire Police produced a report into the Chiory case, but I have never seen it.
7.I would now always present my evidence on screen for the court to see if the opportunity was there. Unfortunately, most courts in this country are not yet fitted out with monitors. Those courts where monitors are a permanent fixture (court of appeal) are sometimes too small or too far away from the jury (crown court). However, it has got to be the way forward and I would not like to have to go back to charts. This was highlighted at the appeal court where for example the same characteristic (or one in the same location) was referred to by several different numbers and caused unnecessary confusion. Once on screen we could disregard the numbers and just look at the location. Finally, my colleagues and I produce one presentation, the Met on the other hand had five different (but similar) powerpoints.
Best wishes, Alan.
8. The characteristics of blood on the fingerprint ridges were talked about in evidence. Langenburg's study was referred to but used selectively (in my view) by one of the witnesses from the Met.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:13 am
by Michael W. Wieners
Hi Glenn, thanks for your comments.

As you know, Daoud was identified via fingerprints by the SNP. I have no idea if his DNA was identified on the backpack. If it was, it was subsequent (way subsequent) to the fingerprint identification.

By the way, the last line of your post script about author introductions to papers made me laugh out loud.

I'll contact you off line.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:56 am
by Taggart
Thanks Alan for your responses. For clarity can you explain how the Met came to be involved in this case?

I was wondering after the Appeal if Nottingham maybe had to call in an outside Agency as the result of the Appeal would have brought in a potential non-compliance under UKAS Accreditation. (I am of course assuming Nottingham were accredited?)

If so, who actually brought the Met in? Was it Nottingham? Was it UKAS?

Also out of interest, given you disgaree with the findings of the Met, do you personally believe their 'incorrect' conclusions to be down to incompetence? Or have you any other thoughts?

Thanks

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2012 4:17 am
by alangore
Hi Taggart,

The answers to your questions are as follows:-
1. The Metropolitan Police were requested by Notts Police to carry out an independent analysis of the evidence.
2. Notts fingerprint bureau were accredited to ISO9001. As there was no non-compliance, UKAS were not involved.
3. The Metropolitan Police team gave their expert opinions on the evidence and I have no reason to believe that they conducted themselves other than porfessionally.

I am going to be away for a few days now, but will be back later next week.

Best wishes Alan.

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2012 4:54 pm
by Taggart
Thanks for your response Alan. As I previously mentioned someone in England referred to this case as the English Shirley McKie. With the disputed fingerprint evidence and the differences of Expert Opinion I can now fully understand what they meant.

I now look forward to the relevant bodies in England looking at this case, and as in Scotland getting a definitive position on the’ disputed’ print. After all the print cannot remain disputed. Do you have any thoughts on who will carry this out, and when such a decision can be expected?

Re: Regina v. Smith (2011)

Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 2:22 pm
by Neville
Hi Michael
Thanks for the reply; the fellow on TV was not an expert that was clear. I am pleased to hear there was one there.

Also good to hear there has been an attitude change, as you say one person's appearance should not reflect on the whole outfit.

Alan
Nice to see some fronting up in the UK, you have my vote of appreciation for what it is worth, good on you.
Neville