CLPEX Chat Board

During testimony as an expert witness recently the defense attorney attempted to discredit me by asking if I knew the specific requirements for individualization of other agencies. When I would answer that I wasn't aware a specific agency had that particular requirement, he would ask me about a different one. After asking the same question in regards to about 4 different agencies he alluded to the fact that I wasn't aware of much outside of my own agency. LOL! Is there a published list of various agencies and there requirements for individualization, especially for those agencies outside of the U.S.? Considering the fact that it would be impossible to memorize the requirements of every agency in the world, does anyone have a suggestion for a good response to this line of questioning? I also wonder if it wouldn't be of some value to create a list of individual agency requirements (assuming there isn't one already out there), if only for curiousity sake....

If you follow the link http://www.xs4all.nl/~dacty/country-rules.htm you will find a list of requirements for several countries. This question is usually asked by defense attorneys in order to create the follow up question "If fingerprints are unique and universally accepted why do different agencies and countries have different individualization requirements?"

Thank you for the link. That was exactly what I was looking for. I noticed that you don't have France listed. That was one of the countries the defense attorney specifically asked me about. He stated that they have a 24 pt. requirement. Does anyone know what Frances requirements are? Does anyone work for an agency within the U.S. that has a minimum point requirement?

In reviewing my court prep folder I found an article that discusses the requirements for individualizations in numerous jurisdictions. The article indicates that France was using a 12 point standard at the time of the article. The article, written by Evett and Williams, is titled "A Review of the Sixteen Points Fingerprint Standard in England and Wales." It was published in the JFI, Volume 46 Number 1.

Re link http://www.xs4all.nl/~dacty/country-rules.htm

Have you checked your own countries requirements on this site?

Is it not true that Aussies require two experts to check ID's.

Our 4(of 5) UK trained experts from Scotland Yard say they needed 2.

I wonder what the accuracy of this site is.

Also, what is it with the Netherlands do they have double standards?

Excellent reference though, I applaud the site for doing what it does, I hope they continue to add to the information given.

We always quoted in court that France required 17 points. So we must have been wrong on that one, I wonder if any cases will have to be re-heard as a result!!!

By the way in Auckland, New Zealand we require two expert checkers.

I thought the requirement was sufficient quality and quantity? Did I fall asleep and miss something Have we moved to a numerical standard in the US?

The following was posted to Onin Forum several years ago. Information was dated (1987) when posted in 2003 and these may have since changed. France is mentioned.

From Fingerprint Whorld, 12:47 (Jan 1987)

USA - No fixed number
Canada - No fixed number
Sweden - 7
Holland, Finland, Greece - 10
Turkey - 8
Germany - 8 to 12
India - 6 to 12
South Africa - 7
Japan, Brazil, Mexico, Yugoslavia, France, ICPO, Australia (Northern Territories has no fixed number), Hong Kong, Ireland - 12
England - 16 (this has been dropped)
Peoples Republic of China - 8 (Change in Hong Kong's points?)